Generation Talk #3: HM and FW

Generation Talk #3: HM (Age 99) and FW (Age 85)

On February 8th, 2025, I had the honor of talking with HM (Age 99) and FW (Age 85). Both are docents at the Lyon Air Museum in Santa Ana.

Born in 1925, HW is part of the Greatest Generation. Born in 1939, FW is part of the Silent Generation. Both of these generations lived through World War II and the Great Depression. People from these two generations are characterized by being selflessly responsible, having a strong work ethic, and showing unwavering patriotism.

Both men discussed growing up during the war and the importance of learning about history. We talked about how war is sometimes necessary for peace. HM and FW shared inspiring stories about how they started with very little and were able to make a good life for themselves and their families.

Most of all, both HM and FW kept emphasizing the importance of education, good work ethics, and ambition to be independent and ultimately succeed in life. A key lesson they both shared is that an individual needs to be strong enough so their voice can be heard to create positive change in the world.

Towards the end of the conversation, my mom, CC (Generation X), joined in on the discussion.

Portrait of FW (on the left) and HM (on the right)

Tell us about your background.

HM: I grew up in Indiana. My mother was a widow with five kids. We didn’t have much money. I was in the US Naval Air Force and trained to become a pilot. I never had combat experience, but I flew a patrol airplane in the Philippines. After the war, I got the G.I. Bill and was able to get a degree in aerospace at Purdue University. After college, I worked as an engineer in aerospace for 40 years. I started out with Douglas Aircraft for about 7 years, and then went to Ford Aerospace.

FW: I was six years old when World War II ended. Germany was covered in rubble. Most of the houses were gone and demolished. I spent part of my time with my grandparents on a farm, but most of the time in the city of Bremen. Food was scarce at the time, and there was very little schooling. We didn’t have paper or pencils to write with.

I have never served in the armed forces. When I came to America, I got a draft card right away, and I was ready for the draft. The Vietnam War was going on at the time. But then I got married, so my priorities changed, and I never served in any military forces.

What is your favorite thing about volunteering at the Lyon Air Museum?

HM: I really like being with people. I really like educating younger generations about history. I’d also rather be out here doing something than sitting at home doing nothing. I also like telling people about my story.

FW: Yes, I like meeting people too. Also, sometimes I see veterans who come in and want someone they can talk to. They want to tell me about their stories. Sometimes, their children or grandchildren don’t want to listen to what they went through because they aren’t interested. So when I see veterans come in here, I always like listening and letting them talk.

Why do you think it's important to teach future generations about World War II and history in general?

HM: Well, it’s important to learn what happened in the past and try to avoid the bad things. We’ve had many wars, and learning about them will help us avoid mistakes in the future.

FW: I agree with HM, one hundred percent. You know, war is bad, but we have to have armed forces to maintain peace in the world. Nothing else will work. You can’t talk to bad guys in the world and convince them that peace is the better choice than war. The only thing a bully understands is force.

Our leaders have to maintain peace by making sure to build up a superior military so that the opponents understand what will happen if they’re not working towards peace.

But yes, I think it’s really important to teach young people about history. That’s why HM and I are here at the museum teaching kids about World War II.

What did you do for fun as a kid?

HM: Well, I played basketball and baseball. We didn’t have football or soccer. But mostly, I worked. Since my mother was a widow with five kids, I had to do lots of farm work, like milking cows and feeding the chickens. We had a small farm and had to raise our own food. I didn’t ever feel like I was overworked, though. I lived in a small town, so I knew everyone who lived there, and we would play yard games with siblings and friends.

FW: After the war in Germany, everything was rubble. There was barely any schooling, so I spent my free time playing in the ruins of houses that were bombed down. I loved soccer, so we played soccer with whatever we could find because we didn’t have soccer balls. We played games where you draw on the sidewalk, like hopscotch. We also played hide-and-seek in the ruined buildings.

How did you get your news when you were a kid?

HM: I read the newspaper, although, I’ll admit that most of what I read was related to sports. My parents and I would listen to the radio, too. But I was aware of what was going on with the war at that time.

My uncle served in World War I in Europe. We visited him in Colorado in 1940. I remembered seeing him pacing on the front porch when France capitulated to Germany. He was really, really worried about what was going to happen. My parents told me this news.

FW: Actually, there were no newspapers in Bremen, Germany, where I grew up. Everything was just flat-out ruins and people lived in the ruins and in the basements if the basements were still there. The first months or year or two years were not very pretty. But as kids, you get used to it. When I was five years old during the last year of the bombing runs, my dad was in the front lines. When the air raid sirens came, my mom grabbed two things before we went down to the bunker: mattresses and the radio. The radio was our only source of information for the news.

What advice would you like to give to other generations?

HM: Getting a good education is so important. It can solve just about anything, if you learn about the rest of the world and are aware of what’s going on. Education allows you to independently judge what’s right or wrong. It’s the best thing you can get to help the world. My mother valued education and always expected my siblings and I to get good grades.

FW: I totally agree with HM! I also think it’s important to teach children about democracy and how to make money. Money is important. It makes you independent.

HM: And you get that with education. It all comes down to education.

FW, you are from the Silent Generation. HM, you are from the Greatest Generation. Both of these generations are known for their discipline, consistent work ethic, and placing duty over personal desires. Do you feel that younger generations share these values? Why or why not?

HM: I don’t think it’s too much of a generational thing. I think it really depends on the individual and their family, and how they were raised.

FW: Yes, it depends on the culture that you were brought up in. I have always been taught that working hard is very important, and that eventually, it will pay off. I try to bring my children up in this way too and tell them to have a good work ethic. If you want to relax or want more entertainment, you always can do that, but if you don’t have a good basic work ethic, you can’t do other things unless you’re leeching off other people.

HM: Some people have good work ethics, some people don’t. But like education, a strong work ethic is necessary for being independent.

A very impressive amount of mobilization was required in America for World War II. Do you think that if America had to do something like this again, would we be able to do it?

HM: I think so. If we had a reason to, we would mobilize, unify, and defend. However, we did need a lot of good leadership during World War II. Roosevelt was able to do that, and he did a great job of bringing the country together. I hope we have the same kind of leadership that’s needed in the future if this kind of thing were to happen again.

FW: Yes, Roosevelt was a great leader. He knew how to pull the people together. If we had a national disaster, I think this nation would pull together like no one else. I strongly believe that.

But war is not good. It is an ugly thing and needs to be prevented.

HM: Yes. Apparently, in the 5,000 years of history recorded, there were 15,000 conflicts. There’s always a conflict. That’s how people are. Leaders always want to occupy a weaker nation for their ego. It’s pretty sad when you think about it. Humans are just like animals, it’s all self-protection. It’s the idea of “I don’t eat you first, you’ll eat me” kind of thing.

 (At this point, my mom, CC (Generation X), sat down at the table and joined the conversation.)

CC: That’s why we have to study hard—so we can be strong and prepared for whatever may come. That’s what I always tell my kids.

Sometimes I get worried when I see the younger generation on their phones and doing things that are, in my opinion, not productive. I’m scared that their brains won’t be able to think very critically. That is a danger for me, as a person raising the next generation.

HM: You know, they’re trying to ban phones in school right now.

CC: Yes, and I think that could be helpful. I mean, we all studied with books, paper, and pencil. But now, everything is online. My kids have to submit their homework online, too.

FW: Do you see a solution to that, CC?

CC: Well, I just tell my children that technology is just a tool to make you more efficient. But if you’re using it in a way where you’re not efficient, then that’s not a good use of that technology. And technology shouldn’t ever take the place of face-to-face conversations or sitting down and thinking. Nowadays, people are so quick to Google things and accept whatever’s online as an answer.

FW: I see your point. But it’s also true that everything is more practical with devices.

HM: Yes, it’s a tough situation.

FW: It does make teachers’ jobs easier if things are online.

You know, sometimes I’m happy that I was never confronted with this problem about misusing technology.

CC: Well, I think every generation had their own challenges.

HM: Yes, there’s always a different challenge to confront.

CC: For you, it was about trying to get food and going through the war, but for the younger generation, it’s technology. I see how technology negatively affects the new generation. Sometimes, I’m not so sure America could pull together like it did back when World War II happened.

HM: Well, I can’t really think of anyone in our government that’s a very suitable leader right now if that were to happen.

You know, I was reading a book about presidents, and a lot of them came from nothing. Eisenhower is a perfect example. He was very poor and had to work as a kid. Lincoln had it even worse. He grew up in a log cabin in Kentucky!

CC: Do you think that having that adversity in childhood helps a person when they become older?

HM: Yes, that adversity gives them lots of strength. If they have the gusto to overcome that stuff, they become a better leader. They have more built-in ambition. It’s amazing how some of the greatest leaders came from nothing. Who has the ambition to do that right now? We don’t know!

FW: Well, there’s the story of Henry J. Kaiser. He was the son of poor immigrants and built an empire. He built those Liberty ships—one ship a day! He built cars, aircraft, and he was mining, all of this from nothing. He had no education, but he worked really hard to educate himself and create his own path to success. Education to me is very, very important!

HW: Abraham Lincoln had to educate himself, too. There are stories of him writing by the flame of a candle. He found people who had books and borrowed them. He was very driven.

FW: Yes, it’s very impressive, how much some people can make out of nothing.

I felt truly honored and blessed to have a conversation with these two great men about their life experiences. I encourage everyone to go to the Lyon Air Museum. HM and FW will teach you about American history and share their valuable experiences and wisdom. We have much to learn from them and everyone in their generations.

(This conversation has been edited for clarity.)