Generation Talk

This is my project, Generation Talk. 

In this project, my goal is to create a collection of unique conversations, each between two people from different generations. These dialogues will be displayed in text, along with a portrait of the two individuals to capture the spirit and emotion of the interaction.

I want to explore themes of change and continuity across different time periods. What are some of the different challenges from each generation? How did specific generational elements affect each person, positively or negatively? Are there recurring patterns across different generations?

Most importantly, I hope that this project helps different people to come together, share a laugh, and realize that maybe they aren’t so different after all.

Scroll down to read some of these conversations!

Generation Talk #1: CC (Age 51) and PQ (Age 15)

On January 3rd, 2025, I, PQ, talked with my 51-year-old mom, CC, about growing up in an immigrant family and the development of technology.

Portrait of PQ (on the left) and CC (on the right)

Tell us about your background.

HM: I grew up in Indiana. My mother was a widow with five kids. We didn’t have much money. I was in the US Naval Air Force and trained to become a pilot. I never had combat experience, but I flew a patrol airplane in the Philippines. After the war, I got the G.I. Bill and was able to get a degree in aerospace at Purdue University. After college, I worked as an engineer in aerospace for 40 years. I started out with Douglas Aircraft for about 7 years, and then went to Ford Aerospace.

FW: I was six years old when World War II ended. Germany was covered in rubble. Most of the houses were gone and demolished. I spent part of my time with my grandparents on a farm, but most of the time in the city of Bremen. Food was scarce at the time, and there was very little schooling. We didn’t have paper or pencils to write with.

I have never served in the armed forces. When I came to America, I got a draft card right away, and I was ready for the draft. The Vietnam War was going on at the time. But then I got married, so my priorities changed, and I never served in any military forces.

What is your favorite thing about volunteering at the Lyon Air Museum?

HM: I really like being with people. I really like educating younger generations about history. I’d also rather be out here doing something than sitting at home doing nothing. I also like telling people about my story.

FW: Yes, I like meeting people too. Also, sometimes I see veterans who come in and want someone they can talk to. They want to tell me about their stories. Sometimes, their children or grandchildren don’t want to listen to what they went through because they aren’t interested. So when I see veterans come in here, I always like listening and letting them talk.

Why do you think it's important to teach future generations about World War II and history in general?

HM: Well, it’s important to learn what happened in the past and try to avoid the bad things. We’ve had many wars, and learning about them will help us avoid mistakes in the future.

FW: I agree with HM, one hundred percent. You know, war is bad, but we have to have armed forces to maintain peace in the world. Nothing else will work. You can’t talk to bad guys in the world and convince them that peace is the better choice than war. The only thing a bully understands is force.

Our leaders have to maintain peace by making sure to build up a superior military so that the opponents understand what will happen if they’re not working towards peace.

But yes, I think it’s really important to teach young people about history. That’s why HM and I are here at the museum teaching kids about World War II.

What did you do for fun as a kid?

HM: Well, I played basketball and baseball. We didn’t have football or soccer. But mostly, I worked. Since my mother was a widow with five kids, I had to do lots of farm work, like milking cows and feeding the chickens. We had a small farm and had to raise our own food. I didn’t ever feel like I was overworked, though. I lived in a small town, so I knew everyone who lived there, and we would play yard games with siblings and friends.

FW: After the war in Germany, everything was rubble. There was barely any schooling, so I spent my free time playing in the ruins of houses that were bombed down. I loved soccer, so we played soccer with whatever we could find because we didn’t have soccer balls. We played games where you draw on the sidewalk, like hopscotch. We also played hide-and-seek in the ruined buildings.

How did you get your news when you were a kid?

HM: I read the newspaper, although, I’ll admit that most of what I read was related to sports. My parents and I would listen to the radio, too. But I was aware of what was going on with the war at that time.

My uncle served in World War I in Europe. We visited him in Colorado in 1940. I remembered seeing him pacing on the front porch when France capitulated to Germany. He was really, really worried about what was going to happen. My parents told me this news.

FW: Actually, there were no newspapers in Bremen, Germany, where I grew up. Everything was just flat-out ruins and people lived in the ruins and in the basements if the basements were still there. The first months or year or two years were not very pretty. But as kids, you get used to it. When I was five years old during the last year of the bombing runs, my dad was in the front lines. When the air raid sirens came, my mom grabbed two things before we went down to the bunker: mattresses and the radio. The radio was our only source of information for the news.

What advice would you like to give to other generations?

HM: Getting a good education is so important. It can solve just about anything, if you learn about the rest of the world and are aware of what’s going on. Education allows you to independently judge what’s right or wrong. It’s the best thing you can get to help the world. My mother valued education and always expected my siblings and I to get good grades.

FW: I totally agree with HM! I also think it’s important to teach children about democracy and how to make money. Money is important. It makes you independent.

HM: And you get that with education. It all comes down to education.

FW, you are from the Silent Generation. HM, you are from the Greatest Generation. Both of these generations are known for their discipline, consistent work ethic, and placing duty over personal desires. Do you feel that younger generations share these values? Why or why not?

HM: I don’t think it’s too much of a generational thing. I think it really depends on the individual and their family, and how they were raised.

FW: Yes, it depends on the culture that you were brought up in. I have always been taught that working hard is very important, and that eventually, it will pay off. I try to bring my children up in this way too and tell them to have a good work ethic. If you want to relax or want more entertainment, you always can do that, but if you don’t have a good basic work ethic, you can’t do other things unless you’re leeching off other people.

HM: Some people have good work ethics, some people don’t. But like education, a strong work ethic is necessary for being independent.

A very impressive amount of mobilization was required in America for World War II. Do you think that if America had to do something like this again, would we be able to do it?

HM: I think so. If we had a reason to, we would mobilize, unify, and defend. However, we did need a lot of good leadership during World War II. Roosevelt was able to do that, and he did a great job of bringing the country together. I hope we have the same kind of leadership that’s needed in the future if this kind of thing were to happen again.

FW: Yes, Roosevelt was a great leader. He knew how to pull the people together. If we had a national disaster, I think this nation would pull together like no one else. I strongly believe that.

But war is not good. It is an ugly thing and needs to be prevented.

HM: Yes. Apparently, in the 5,000 years of history recorded, there were 15,000 conflicts. There’s always a conflict. That’s how people are. Leaders always want to occupy a weaker nation for their ego. It’s pretty sad when you think about it. Humans are just like animals, it’s all self-protection. It’s the idea of “I don’t eat you first, you’ll eat me” kind of thing.

 (At this point, my mom, CC (Generation X), sat down at the table and joined the conversation.)

CC: That’s why we have to study hard—so we can be strong and prepared for whatever may come. That’s what I always tell my kids.

Sometimes I get worried when I see the younger generation on their phones and doing things that are, in my opinion, not productive. I’m scared that their brains won’t be able to think very critically. That is a danger for me, as a person raising the next generation.

HM: You know, they’re trying to ban phones in school right now.

CC: Yes, and I think that could be helpful. I mean, we all studied with books, paper, and pencil. But now, everything is online. My kids have to submit their homework online, too.

FW: Do you see a solution to that, CC?

CC: Well, I just tell my children that technology is just a tool to make you more efficient. But if you’re using it in a way where you’re not efficient, then that’s not a good use of that technology. And technology shouldn’t ever take the place of face-to-face conversations or sitting down and thinking. Nowadays, people are so quick to Google things and accept whatever’s online as an answer.

FW: I see your point. But it’s also true that everything is more practical with devices.

HM: Yes, it’s a tough situation.

FW: It does make teachers’ jobs easier if things are online.

You know, sometimes I’m happy that I was never confronted with this problem about misusing technology.

CC: Well, I think every generation had their own challenges.

HM: Yes, there’s always a different challenge to confront.

CC: For you, it was about trying to get food and going through the war, but for the younger generation, it’s technology. I see how technology negatively affects the new generation. Sometimes, I’m not so sure America could pull together like it did back when World War II happened.

HM: Well, I can’t really think of anyone in our government that’s a very suitable leader right now if that were to happen.

You know, I was reading a book about presidents, and a lot of them came from nothing. Eisenhower is a perfect example. He was very poor and had to work as a kid. Lincoln had it even worse. He grew up in a log cabin in Kentucky!

CC: Do you think that having that adversity in childhood helps a person when they become older?

HM: Yes, that adversity gives them lots of strength. If they have the gusto to overcome that stuff, they become a better leader. They have more built-in ambition. It’s amazing how some of the greatest leaders came from nothing. Who has the ambition to do that right now? We don’t know!

FW: Well, there’s the story of Henry J. Kaiser. He was the son of poor immigrants and built an empire. He built those Liberty ships—one ship a day! He built cars, aircraft, and he was mining, all of this from nothing. He had no education, but he worked really hard to educate himself and create his own path to success. Education to me is very, very important!

HW: Abraham Lincoln had to educate himself, too. There are stories of him writing by the flame of a candle. He found people who had books and borrowed them. He was very driven.

FW: Yes, it’s very impressive, how much some people can make out of nothing.

I felt truly honored and blessed to have a conversation with these two great men about their life experiences. I encourage everyone to go to the Lyon Air Museum. HM and FW will teach you about American history and share their valuable experiences and wisdom. We have much to learn from them and everyone in their generations.

(This conversation has been edited for clarity.)

Generation Talk #4: LW (Age 83) and CW (Age 47)

On February 23rd, 2025, I sat at a kitchen table with Ms. Lore Waechter and her daughter, Ms. Caryn Waechter. We talked about growing up and how they both found the right path for their lives. We explored parental expectations and how those may have shaped their reality. In addition, we discussed how to adapt and maintain balance amidst a changing society with technological advances that impact every aspect of our lives.   

Portrait of LW (on the left) and CW (on the right)

Tell us about your background.

LW: My name is Lore Waechter, and I’m 83 years old. I was born in Switzerland during WWII. Switzerland remained neutral during the war, so I was not really affected by it. However, I remember that I was afraid of the Germans invading Switzerland. There were food rations. Sometimes, at night, we had to darken our windows because of airplanes flying overhead. We lived on a farm on the edge of the city, where we had fruit trees, potatoes, vegetables, and berries. We had rabbits, chickens, and even a goat. I had a pretty happy childhood. My grandfather lived with us at the time. I have two brothers, one younger and one older. I had my education in Switzerland and eventually came to the United States in 1964.

CW: My name is Caryn Waechter, and I am 47 years old. I was born in Oakland, California. We lived there until I was five, and then we moved to Austria. We were there for a couple years, and then we moved to Germany. In the third grade, we moved back here to California. We had lots of opportunities to go places like Brazil and Hong Kong because of my father’s job, but I wanted to stay in America because my cousins were here. I have asthma, too, so I wanted to be by the beach. So, we ended up here. My uncle lived on Spyglass Hill. I ended up going to Boston College on the opposite side of America, and then I went to grad school at Columbia University. I studied English in college and film in grad school. And finally, I moved back here to LA in 2017 because I’m in the film business.

What were some of the expectations that your parents had for you? What effects did these expectations have? Were they positive or negative?

LW: My parents always wanted me to be honest and try my best. I was also expected to go to church every Sunday. I had to help around the house, because we had a large yard. I had to water the plants, because we did not have sprinkler systems back then. We also sold eggs to our neighbors.

I think these expectations had a positive effect on me. I learned to work around the house. I became a good person, a responsible person.

But as for what I wanted to do with my life, my parents gave me lots of freedom. They wanted me to do whatever I felt like doing. They thought I could decide for myself.

CW: My parents always wanted me to work hard and do well, too. They had high expectations for me and always pushed me to do my best. They wanted me to have integrity and be a good person. I worked hard and did well in school. I was always at the top of my class. I was shyer and more introverted, so I just focused on my schoolwork. I read a lot when I was little.

But overall, I think my parents gave me a lot of freedom of what I wanted to do in my life. They encouraged me to chase my dreams. They just wanted me to do well at whatever I chose to do.

What were some of the expectations and dreams you had for yourself? What did you end up choosing to do in your life? Did this come into conflict with the expectations that your parents had for you?

LW: I had an interest in geography. I was always really good at remembering the names of little towns. I loved to see the world map and seeing the names of cities and mountains.

I always had a secret ambition to be a doctor. Medicine was fascinating to me. I could have probably done it, but I never gave it a chance, because I also wanted to be a mother. Back then, being both seemed impossible, and becoming a mother was my priority, so I never became a doctor. It was pretty common in those days. Girls wanted to get married. If you weren’t married by 35, you were looked down upon.

Since I didn’t choose the path of being a doctor, I knew I was interested in geography, so I thought about working at a travel agency or a hotel. I loved meeting people from other countries, and I was really good at languages. I wanted to see the world.

So then, I decided that I wanted to become an air stewardess. Back then, air stewardesses were very sophisticated. You had to be 23 before you could apply, and you had to learn three languages. I was 20 when I came up with this idea, so I went to England for a year to learn English, and then to Spain to learn Spanish.

I also went to business school in order to become a stewardess. I was an intern at an insurance company. It was an apprenticeship program where you worked in a company for three years and went to school on the side about two days a week. I learned accounting, bookkeeping, languages, and correspondence. I had to learn shorthand, a language you can use to write down messages quickly. Someone would dictate a letter to me, and I had to write it all down in shorthand. I also had to learn how to type, because you couldn’t make mistakes on typewriters. You had to be perfect. You had to know how to spell things correctly. There was no backspace button!

But when I came back from Spain, I saw an ad in the paper. An American international company was looking for a bilingual secretary. Instead of trying to be an air stewardess, I applied, and I got this job instead. Back then, the company was called Willis Jeep. They mainly supplied the military. Then, my boss was transferred to California, and he offered to sponsor me to go to California so I could go work with him. I thought it was a great opportunity to see the world, so I came to America by myself in 1964 with a one-way ticket that cost 4,000 Francs*. That was a lot of money back then. I started working at Kaiser Center in Oakland. In that same office building, I met my future husband on a blind date in a cafeteria. Somebody who knew me and knew my husband put us together. He had come to California a few months earlier. And now we’ve been together for 60 years. It was like love at first sight!

We got married, and I became a mother. Later on, when my daughter, Caryn, was in high school, I became a travel agent. It all worked out really well.

My husband and I love to travel now. Our favorite place is Tahiti. We like the people, the music, the water. We like snorkeling; we like the air. We had our honeymoon there. We also went to Africa and the southern tip of South America, around the horn. We went to Norway; we know Europe quite well.

And that’s really all I wanted to do in life. My parents were very open about what I could choose to do. My mother was always happy that I was happy. She was happy that I found a nice man and had two beautiful children. I’ve always just gone with my instincts and my inner voice. I think I chose the right path for myself.

*In 1964, 1 USD = 4.37 Francs, so 4000 Francs = 915 USD.

CW: I always wanted to do something that I really loved and was good at.

I think I had the brains to be a doctor; I only missed one question on my math SAT. But I was too emotional to be a doctor. I was really afraid of blood. My brother wanted to be a doctor, and I remember visiting my brother in med school. We’d watch dead bodies being worked on and I would always get pretty uncomfortable! I think it’s cool that my brother and I are very different, though.

The English SAT portion was harder for me, but it’s ironic because I was actually more inclined to move in that direction. I’ve always loved telling stories and expressing myself. I’ve always been an artist. My uncle was an artist, and I really connected with him.

I studied English in college. I went to London for a year, and I was still trying to figure out what I wanted to do.

In my senior year of college, I realized I wanted to go into film, and specifically, be a film critic. I found that film is such a great median because it incorporates so many aspects of art. I also love collaborating and building something with a team.

But when I went to film school, I realized I was pushed more to create, so I ended up being a filmmaker and photographer. It fills my heart; I love it. I always work during off-hours—I’m a night person. There’s no clear divide between my work and my personal life. But I really love my work. It’s not always easy, and it’s hard to make a movie, it’s hard to get the funds for it. But it’s so satisfying when it all comes together. The shooting part is really intense. You have no sleep. It feels like you’re going into battle. There are lots of hurdles, but it’s definitely what I love to do. It satisfies my expectations, and my parents are very supportive of it as well.

I have done two movies so far. My first movie is called the Sisterhood of Night. It’s a modern version of the Salem witch trials set in today’s digital age. I worked on that with my friend I went to film school with. It took 10 years to make this movie. We were female filmmakers, and back then, women’s stories didn’t really seem as wanted as they are now, so we had to go through a lot. I had to prove myself to people, and it was challenging. But I’m really happy with it. I wanted to make a movie that I didn’t grow up with—a movie that was for young girls about the importance of girl friendships. I felt like a lot of movies I grew up with were about how boys completed girls’ lives, and I just wanted to do a movie that built confidence for young ladies and gave them a greater sense of independence. I wanted to talk about the complexity and importance of friendships at that age. It was really fun—thirty days of shooting in upstate New York. The actors were all young girls, and they were really good actors.

When I came to California, I made my second movie. It’s called Deadcon. It’s a young adult horror movie about a bunch of influencers who go to a convention for YouTubers that takes place of Disneyland. They’re all staying in a hotel, and it’s a haunted hotel.

I think it's really interesting how technology has changed people, and I’ve always been really interested in that. I always try to include those ideas in my work.

I’m grateful my parents pushed me to go after my dreams. Being a filmmaker is not the easiest job, and it’s hard to be in the film business, especially after COVID, the strikes, and the fires. There are lots of ups and downs. But everyone likes to watch movies, so the film industry isn’t going away. 

Each time I make a movie, I get better and learn a lot, so I’m really ready for my next one. I’m currently working on my third movie, which is going to be a camping horror movie. It will be fun, because I love camping!

CW, you mentioned your interest in tech as a guiding idea in your work. What do you think about the evolution of technology and its effects on people?

CW: Technology has evolved a lot over the years, especially in film, with streaming and Netflix. Movies used to come out in DVDs. But now, they go directly to streaming, which changes the numbers for the whole industry.

In film school, the tech that we had to deal with changed so drastically. I had to keep up with new cameras and social media. Lots of my peers refuse to go into social media, but I feel like it’s important, especially for the film business. It’s essential for my business because it’s a way to share my work. I use Facebook and try to keep up with the evolution of technology. But it really can be overwhelming sometimes.

LW: I think that with the rise of technology, everything has gotten so much more complex. Technology has given us so many opportunities. My children had many more opportunities than I did. My parents were middle class, they weren’t very poor, yet I had a much simpler life.

CW: Yes, technology has changed so rapidly throughout different generations.

I think that my generation saw the biggest change in technology, because we grew up with so many changes, and it’s still changing so quickly.

When I was in high school, we didn’t have much technology. But my parents did get me a cell phone when I was a teenager. It was really big, and I hated it because nobody else had one. My parents made me bring it around, but I would leave it behind a lot. It was for safety, not like how phones are used today. My parents just wanted to be able to get in touch with me if my car broke down.

I’ve seen technology change a lot. My generation grew up with things like cassettes, VHS, DVDs, and vinyl all while experiencing things like Facebook, email, and personal computers. So I appreciate technology, but I think I’m also more analog than the younger generation.

I feel like technology has changed our methods of communication, too. Like when I talk to my niece, I always expect her to call, but she’s more of a texter. In my generation, we call. I think that the older generation likes calling, too. I’m also one of the few people who still write letters. Letters are so special nowadays because they’re so rare.

But that’s what my parents’ generation was about, letter-writing. Mom, you would write letters to your parents.

LW: Yes, phone calls in Switzerland were very expensive. There was a timer, no more than three minutes. So I wrote letters to my mother a lot. Even my husband wrote to my mother to ask for her blessings in our marriage. Everything was done in writing.

CW: I also remember growing up and having phone calls with my grandparents because they were in Europe. It was very rare. Or we would send updates on a cassette. My grandma would send us a cassette and we’d record something and send it back. Communication was totally different back then. Now, it’s so much more immediate.

LW: There’s Facetime now.

CW: Yes, we Facetime my mom’s brothers in Switzerland every week now. So it’s amazing how far we’ve come with technology.

Do you think there are any negative effects of technology?

CW: Well, when I was in high school, I had to remember people’s phone numbers. But I do not know anybody’s phone number today! I don’t even know your cell phone number, Mom. Do you know my cell phone number?

LW: No.

CW: Okay, yeah. I feel like my memory isn’t as good now that technology is so advanced, and that’s why I’m trying to read more. I do feel like we have too much information now, so we just can’t grasp it all.

We have so many new tools, and I have to keep learning how to use them. Sometimes, I resist new technology, like AI. I don’t want to touch it! But I feel like I have to embrace it at some point. I have a video I need to edit, and my client told me to try AI, so I think I might try some AI to help me out. But I’m on the fence about it.

I see some of the photos and art that they’re creating by stealing from all the other art that’s online. Why do they have to take artists’ work? I think art is so human and personal, so I don’t like that aspect of AI.

But that’s what happened with everything, like the advent of email and the internet; there’s always some pushback. I think it’s about finding a balance, like everything else. And it’s important to take some time to just cut off technology. As I get older, I’m enjoying nature more and more. Sometimes, I can feel myself getting overwhelmed, so it’s important to take time away from technology and get outside.

LW: You know, my husband relies on Siri. He’s always like, “Siri, get me home!” And I tell him that he should know his way home. He relies too much on Siri. I think I rely more on my brain to find my way.

CW: She really likes maps.

LW: Yes, I’m a map reader. I use GPS if it’s somewhere complicated, but I try not to rely on Siri to tell me where to go. I still like using my brain to find my way. You can’t rely on technology too much. Especially as I get older, I think it’s important for me to keep working my brain. I love the communication aspect though; I love to see people on the phone.

Everything is email now, with my friends in Europe and my friends from high school. It’s wonderful to have that connection that wouldn’t exist without email. There’s a person who lives in France and grew up in Switzerland like I did. She had an interesting life and she’s a good writer; she could be a journalist. She writes so well in German even though she lives in France. My husband loves to write to her too, because she’s so interesting. He likes to correspond with other people around the world. And that would not be possible without technology.

However, I do miss getting thank you notes. No one writes them nowadays. I love getting letters. Handwritten notes are really nice and mean a lot to me.

CW: My parents communicate a lot with friends in Europe, so that’s definitely a real benefit to technology.

LW: Yes, friends in England, Spain, Germany. It’s great to talk to them by email. Or Facetime sometimes, too. Texting is also convenient.

CW: At the end of the day, it’s all about finding that balance.

There’s always going to be good and bad. There’s a lot of bad stuff on the Internet, but there’s also a lot of good stuff, too. I put that idea in my first movie, about how the Internet connects people, but how being able to be anonymous on the Internet has also brought out the worst in people.

LW: Yes, everything is about finding balance. It’s like eating, too. Not too much sugar, not too much fat.

What were the expectations for women in your generation? How was it different from the expectations for women today?

LW: Well, the expectations for me and other girls my age were pretty much to get married and have a family. Most of my friends got married. Some didn’t, but they were unhappy single women. Having a family was the way to go back then.

But today, women are not expected to be married at a certain age. Some want to get married later and have children later in life. And if they don’t want to get married, they can have a career, and that’s fine. It’s really different now. You can be single.

CW: In my generation, women around me mostly just wanted to do well in school and go after a career they loved. So among my friends, some had a goal of starting a family. I thought I would be married and have a family too, but it just didn’t happen. My goal was to have a career that I loved. That was my first priority. But time went by so fast, and it just didn’t happen. Women have been much more motivated to choose their career or marriage and kids, so getting married and having kids have gotten pushed back to a later average age. But there’s always the biological clock thing. I was shooting a documentary on IVF. Women in their 40s struggle with having kids, so they do IVF to get artificially inseminated, but it always looks very intense and expensive. And I know a lot of friends who have had their eggs retrieved and saved for later in life. It’s pretty common today, because women put more importance on careers, and everything has been pushed back.

Even though I didn’t have kids, I feel like I have a lot of kids through my friends. I’m like the cool aunt! My friends have the everyday ins and outs of being a parent, but I’m just here to bring the energy and fun. I have a very youthful spirit.

I also kind of feel like my movies are my children. It takes many years to build up, and they live on and have a message. But I don’t really have any regrets in my life. I’m thankful for all the opportunities and support my parents have given me. I’ve just tried to make the most out of it.

CW, what’s it like being a female in the film industry?

CW: A lot of my friends in film are male. They definitely get more money for their projects. But there have been a lot more opportunities for females in film more recently. It’s great to see that there are a lot of bold new films from female directors. When I started, there weren’t as many women as there are now. I’m so happy more women are getting into film!

Thank you to Ms. Lore and Ms. Caryn for such an engaging conversation! I truly appreciate the candor and insight from these two incredible women.

Tell us about your background and how you came to America.

MC: I was born in China. I’m not sure what city, but I was born in the northern part of the province of Jiangsu.

When I was eight, we moved to Taiwan. I had my education all the way to college in Taiwan for twenty years. Then, I came to the United States in 1967 and went to the University of Missouri-Rolla. After getting my doctorate degree in chemical engineering, I moved to Canada and stayed there for about a year and a half. Then, I went to Boston for about a year and worked for a battery company called Duracell. After that, I moved to Detroit. In 1978, I came to California to start my own adhesive company called Tuff Industries.

YQ: I was born in China. I went to elementary school and one year of middle school in China, and then I came to the US and went to Minnesota, where I attended high school and college. After college graduation, I went to Japan to work for four years. When I came back to the US, I went to UC Berkeley for business school, where I met my wife. We were in Berkeley for seven years, from 1998 to 2005. Then, we moved here to Southern California.

What were some of the challenges you faced while coming to America? How did these challenges affect you?

MC: First of all, the language barrier. Language is one of the hardest things for anyone who comes to the US from another country. But fortunately, when I was in Taiwan, I worked for a British company called ICI—Imperial Chemical Industries. At that time, we had to use English. I worked there for about a year and a half, so I learned a bit of English. When I came to this country, at least I was able to speak a bit.

Also, you have to be able to communicate with Americans. You have to learn how to live in their society. I couldn’t just stay isolated and live in Chinatown. You need to adopt the American way of life.

YQ: I agree. I think the language barrier was the biggest challenge. For me, besides the language, one additional challenge was trying to get the legal status to stay in the US long-term. There was a period of time when I wasn’t sure if I could stay, so I felt really unstable about my future.

MC: I didn’t have to deal with these feelings of instability. I came to the US to go to graduate school through a set path. Immigrants seeking education in the US would apply, and the US wanted you to stay. During that time, around the 1960s to 1970s, America almost automatically let you come here if you were educated and seeking more education. I mean, it was almost like a freebie. The other country educates you, and now you come to the US to work here, contribute, and pay taxes.

YQ: Yes, so in the 1960s and 1970s, I think if you were educated and you had some technical skills to contribute, it was practically guaranteed that you could stay. But twenty to thirty years after that, which is when I came to the US, it was a little more difficult. The US was less eager to accept immigrants. Nevertheless, I was able to stay. Now, thirty years later, it’s even more difficult. You can see the transition from the 1960s to 1970s where the US really welcomed educated immigrants, and then the 1980s and 1990s, where it was a little harder, and now, where it’s probably even more difficult.

But one thing I do want to comment on is that, yes, language is a big challenge. Another challenge is culture. We use culture as a big word. We as immigrants wanted to learn the American way. Back then, when we first came to this country, there was less about diversity and inclusion like there is today, less about accepting people from different backgrounds. The onus was on the immigrants to conform, to learn the American way; not the other way around, for the Americans to accommodate the immigrants. And actually, I don’t think it’s a bad thing.

MC: Yes, I agree. Immigrants were definitely expected to conform to American culture a lot more back then. Another major difference is that during my time many Americans were really eager to get to know and talk to immigrants. Today, I don’t see that as much.

YQ: It’s kind of an interesting dynamic. It’s almost ironic or paradoxical—fifty years ago, society as a whole was less accommodating. Everywhere you went, it was all in English. There weren’t any Chinese, Japanese, or Spanish signs and menus, no non-English translations. In that sense, society was less accommodating to immigrants. That’s what I meant about the burden being on the immigrants to conform and learn the American way. However, at the very personal level, the people that we came into contact with when we immigrated here were much friendlier than today. They wanted to help you, they accepted you. They were very generous.

Now, society on the surface seems to be more accommodating. You have non-English signs everywhere. But in actuality, on a deeper level, people are less accepting of immigrants. It’s really paradoxical!

Why do you think people are less accommodating to immigrants now?

YQ: I think it has to do with economics. Fifty years ago, Americans were much more well-off compared to the rest of the world. There’s an old saying—when you have enough to eat and you’re full, you can be more generous. But when you’re a little hungrier, you start fighting everyone for scraps of food. Now that some people in America are not in as good of an economic situation as before, they are less likely to be kind to immigrants.

MC: Yes, after World War II, America was very powerful and strong. When I came here, the US was the top of the world. And that’s the reason I came here. The best place to go was the US, and the best way to come here legally was to apply for graduate school. So, for young people like me at that time, that was the only way they could come here. We all followed this path and came here in this way.

Immigration is a major topic today. What do you think about immigration? Is it good or bad? What is its role in our country?

MC: Well, we’re all immigrants. From my time, immigrants were good, of course. But now, there’s more conflict between immigrants and so-called natives. In the old days, after World War II, no one argued with what Americans said and thought. But now, everyone gets a voice, so immigrants and natives are more hostile.

YQ: In today’s world, there is a lot of anti-immigrant sentiment. If you take a step back, I personally believe that America was built by immigrants. Everyone was once an immigrant. It’s just that at different times, the definition of an immigrant changes.

MC: Like, a long time ago, people immigrated to America from Europe. And during our generations, most of the immigrants were Asian.

YQ: When you look at the time between the 1700s to the 1800s, America had immigration problems, too. But back then, it was the northern and western Europeans against the Irish and Italians. The Irish and Italians were the “immigrants” then. But during westward expansion, the Gold Rush, and the building of the Continental Railroad, most of the Europeans were considered Americans by then. All the Italians and the Irish were integrated already. Then, the new “immigrants” became the Asians, the Chinese, and the Japanese that came to help build the railroads. And then, the definition of an immigrant shifted again. Now, Asians still get a bit of the anti-immigrant sentiment, but it’s mostly the Latin and Central Americans that get it now.

I’d like to have more faith in this country that, at some point, we’ll figure out how to stop having these waves of anti-immigrant sentiment. Right now, it’s difficult because the economy isn’t very smooth. Everyone feels a bit poorer, so they argue and fight. Of course, everyone is a brother when things are going well. But when you’re not happy, and you think you’re not getting a piece of prosperity, that’s when you start pointing fingers, and that’s when phases of anti-immigrant sentiment happen in history. It’s happening now, and it happened before, too, all throughout history. It’s not like the US was always super welcoming of immigration throughout its 300 year history. During the Gold Rush, there were parks in San Francisco which had signs saying, “Chinese and dogs are not allowed”. Obviously, you don’t see that now. But now, most of the anti-immigration sentiment has been redirected towards Latin American people.

But immigration is extremely important, especially for rich countries. Look at all the European countries. They were all once very powerful, and then they got rich. But it always happens like this—the richer a country is, the lower the birth rate. So if you don’t have a good immigration policy to keep the population growing, then your population will decrease, and your country will go downhill. You need new blood in society. That’s why Euro-sclerosis happened, because there wasn’t enough population growth in these European countries, so their economies were very stagnant.

Then, after these European countries, this happened to Asian countries, too. After the war, before Japan’s economic bubble burst, Japan and the US were neck in neck in terms of GDP. There was a lot of anti-Japanese sentiment in the US, because they were afraid that Japan would overtake the US. But what happened to Japan in the last thirty years? The main problem was that the population stopped growing. Now, Japan’s economy is quite stagnant. Korea is going down the same route. And right now, everyone in America is fearful of China. But let’s see, in twenty years. China is going to have issues, too, because their population is starting to stagnate. And they’re very anti-immigrant. My point is, when any country grows rich, the native population tends to stop having kids. So if you don’t have good immigration policy to keep the population growing at a steady rate, then problems are going to happen. This is why immigration is so critical.

But even today, even though the US immigration policy has issues, it is still pretty good compared to other countries. We need to put things into perspective, so let’s not get too pessimistic. It’s still a really good country to immigrate to, and people work really hard here.

What problems do you think there are with the immigration system?

YQ: Well, one thing is that it has to be fair. But you also want people that can contribute to society to come. MC was talking about how fifty years ago, if you want to get a degree, there’s a path for you here. I think that’s a pretty good start, because that means you’re educated, and you have skills to contribute.

People say that America is a “melting pot” of cultures. How did you change culturally when you came to America? Do you ever feel disconnected from your roots? Is this a good or bad thing?

MC: Not really. I’ve basically accepted that I used to be Chinese, and now I’m American. I have to live the American way. I can’t just isolate myself in Chinatown forever. But even though I am living the American way, I still have Chinese culture. I can have both.

YQ: I agree with MC. I consider myself an American, too. I think there are a lot of “cultural” habits that are very good. In fact, that’s what made this country so successful. I believe in best practices. Different countries have different ways of doing things, but that’s why we need to exchange ideas to see what’s the better way. Some people define certain cultural habits with different countries, for example, they call certain habits the “American way” or the “Chinese way”. But I don’t think that practices should be defined by countries. It should just be about finding the best way. 

My interpretation of the American melting pot is actually the best practices that are brought in by different immigrants from different countries. I actually think it’s a great thing. Let’s think about it, the last 100 years. All the great scientific discoveries—Einstein was not American, and Oppenheimer was educated in Europe! In the space program, half of them were German engineers! So when you say the “melting pot,” I hope that it’s not unique to America. Every country should have a melting pot and bring in good ideas from around the world to find the best practices.

MC: Yes. The right way is the right way, and the wrong way is the wrong way. If you kill someone, it doesn’t matter what country you do it in. It’s just wrong.

YQ: Haha, that’s exactly right. And a lot of times people use that kind of simple definition to hide behind the fact that their way is not good. If their way isn’t good, they just say, “Well, that’s just how we do it.” If they’re Chinese, that just becomes the Chinese way. If they’re Japanese, it’s just the Japanese way.

What do you consider your home—America or your home country? Why?

MC: For the first eight years of my life, it was China. For the next twenty years, it was Taiwan. Now, for the last 50 years, it’s been the US. So now, the US is my home. My home is where I live.

YQ: My home is here because you are here, PQ. You and your siblings and your mom are all here.

MC: That’s true. Your grandma is here, and you’re here too, so this is my home. Anywhere could be your home if the family moves there. You shouldn’t be restricted to one specific area or continent.

YQ: There’s a Chinese saying called “天下为家” (tian xia wei jia) —anywhere under the sky could be your home. So for me, it’s wherever my family is.

Did you (or any of your family members) ever feel reluctant about immigrating to America? Why?

MC: No, I don’t think so. This is a good country, a good place to be. So why would you be hesitant about it? I didn’t know anyone who was reluctant. If you choose to move here, you just do it, and you make the best of it.

YQ: I had friends that had the opportunity to come to the US, and they didn’t want to. I think some of them felt that they had better opportunities in China. Personally, if I were them, I wouldn’t make that choice, but they made their decision. But you see a difference in the different generations. In MC’s generation, America was the envy of the world after WWII. It was everyone’s dream to immigrate here. I think 25-30 years after that, which is when I came, America was still the best country in the world, but its reputation was more tainted than before. My family members all came here, but some of my distant family members thought China was better, so they went back.

MC: I chose wherever I thought I could have the best future. During my time, this was the best place. This was the place where I had the highest chance of being the most successful I could be.

MC, I’m your granddaughter. YQ, I’m your daughter. You both were born in China initially, but then you came here and raised me here in America, so I’m not as Chinese as a person being raised in China. When you look at me as a more Americanized person, do you ever feel disappointed that I lost some of my Chinese roots?

YQ: The short answer is no. I always feel that you should be raised as an American first, but I do hope that you open your mind to the Chinese culture and language. Your mom and I tried our best to give that to you from when you were young. But at the end of the day, you have to be successful in this country. By being more Chinese than American, your probability of success is probably lower than being more American than Chinese. That’s just the way it is, and that’s okay. Going back to the melting pot, my interpretation of it is finding the best practices. Having you grow up educated as an American doesn’t mean you should pick up all the American habits, because some of them are not good. You should go out, see the world, and learn from everybody. You’ll come across Chinese students, Japanese students, European students, whoever. You should learn from all of their cultures and philosophies and bring back the best practices for yourself.

MC: You’re an American, but you don’t have to be half Chinese. You just be yourself!

If you did not immigrate to America, what do you think your life would be like?

MC: There’s no if. How can I have an if? I don’t know! My life could be anything. I have absolutely no idea. I do not believe in thinking about an if. Don’t think about what you should have done in the past. It doesn’t matter. Just decide and follow through with it. You have no time to look backwards. You have to keep looking forward.

And if I did not come here, I would not have you as my granddaughter. So, how can I have an if?

YQ: It’s the same for me. If I didn’t come here, I wouldn’t have met your mom and had you or your siblings. Obviously, I don’t want it any other way. Don’t constantly look back and think about what you should’ve, could’ve, or would’ve done.

I don’t know for sure, but I think in terms of probabilities, I do appreciate the fact that I came to the US. I think it’s a very free society. You can do whatever you want. If you work hard, you’ll be rewarded. If I didn’t come here, I would’ve worked hard and probably accomplished some things in China, but probability-wise, I think I would still be more successful here. There is a wider range of opportunities here. You can be successful in other places, but the paths are narrower. But you have a better shot here.

MC: People want to come to America to live their dream. It’s a great place to build a life that you want for yourself.